All Read!!!!!!!!!!

[JamesDeane]

jamesdeane,

You do seem to have a serious problem with the board. I wonder, then, why

you continue to browse it and even go so far as suggest posts to be removed?

You also seem to have a serious problem with the moderation...

For the record, why in god's name would anyone be insulted at being called

a woman, unless you have some problem with womankind? In my case, you
presumed
wrong.

Posts that have reduced presenters to tears contained some pretty serious

allegations and personal insults. They, like most, would laugh off the

'woman' comment. I must ask (as i have before) why are your values so
different
to everyone elses and why do you seem to expect everyone else to
follow
yours?

Best wishes,
John Fleming
www.radiowaves.fm

[Earthworm Jim]

In my best Adrian Kennedy impression......"Hello James, whats your point?"

[Slicklink]

I'm sure you have posted this to each individual forum to get back at John.

Your behaving like one now James, in all fairness (if I may be so bold to suggest so)

[vinylpusher]

What are you trying to achieve James????

[JamesDeane]

THE ONE SIDEDNESS OF THIS BOARD, IT IS MY FINAL POST, ALL THE PEOPLE THAT STARTED ON THIS BOARD WITH ME HAVE LEFT, I TRIED TO GIVE IT A GO BUT NOW REALISE THERE IS NO RIGHT TO FREEDOM OF EXPRESSION HERE

[vinylpusher]

Freedom of expression is one thing, but you must bear in mind that for every opinion, there's an opposite one.
That said, I think John's right in saying that you can't expect everyone on the board to agree with everything you say, all the time.
It's a discussion forum, so no doubt you'll get some debate. Sure isn't that why most of us are here?

[John Fleming]

Apart from the moral ethics behind publicly posting a message sent privately (and i'll be checking the legal ramifications of that), what JAMESDEANE - hiding behind a username of course - failed to mention here is that this was the last email in a series of mails. As he has attempted to give a one-sided account of what's been said, i will go public with what was actually giving mr DEANE grief. As he has posted private details, i assume he has given free reign to return the compliment.

His response to this email (received this morning while he was also posting to the forum presumably) was as follows:

You are an ignorant little man.

You criticise me for commenting on posts and then you get personnal with me in an e-mail response.

If you are a moderator you should be that and refrain from insulting the people who make your board a success.

You are biased and a disgrace."

I will leave it up to others to decide whether the above posted email is insulting. I don't need to tell most of the members here that this is a service provided free of charge, funded from my own pocket for the most part. Not only could i do without this abuse, i could certainly do without contact from legal representation, which has recently been on the increase. And if this board is a success (for others to decide) then i'm not going to have it risked by abusive and derogatory posts. Somebody has to moderate, and by joining, all members here have accepted that we reserve the right to remove posts. And it is not many who would take the time to explain the reasons why either.

JAMESDEANE has caused us problems right back to the old boardhost days - one of the reasons why we had to go members only. And ever since this board went up he's knocked it. Within weeks he was posting:
http://www.radiowavesforum.com/rw/showthread.php?s=&threadid=152
Again, he was entitled to do that, and he was right in what he said. My point for including it is to show the negativity we have been dealing with from him alone.

His post that has caused the problem that you are all being laid witness to was a recent one stating that he's lost interest in the board and was bored with it, which - again - he is quite entitled to do
(On a side note i hope this serves as a response to radio stations, who in demanding that we remove negative posts about them, ask would we allow negative posts about Radiowaves):
http://www.radiowavesforum.com/rw/showthread.php?s=&threadid=732

What he is not entitled to do, however, is to attack those who responded to him. He left us with no choice but to remove his post, for which he wrote asking for an explanation.

I responded as follows:
Your post was removed because of its tone. Those who replied to your original post did not resort to a personal attack on you nor did they cast any aspersions on your personality. They did, however, question the sentiments of the post.
In your reply, you made suggestions about them personally which were inflammatory and likely to lead to a thread full of bitchiness.

You made your point, your respondents made theirs, you are free to defend your points and question theirs but not question the personalities of the people who made them. It is precisely that type of bitchiness which has lead to a drop-off in posts as many people have been put-off taking part in the forums.

Your contributions are, and always will be welcomed, but please restrict yourself to making points about radio (or the site) and not about your fellow posters.

In his reply, he suggested that the fall-off in posts is due to the constant censoring and refusal of us to allow people express free speech. He also suggested that his post was in no way derogatory.
He also said he knows of six people who no longer post because of removal posts. And, in the removed post he felt he had the right to 'correct' the others who posted becaus he'd been "around a lot longer than them".

I attempted to appeal to his better senses:

Your suggestion is taken on board. Maybe in future we can allow the posts to stand and send all solicitor's letters and legal threats in the direction of the users? We would be glad to do that but for the possibility that the site may be affected to.

Your post was derogatory - if you don't see that a suggestion that the posters go back to 'McDonalds' or 'school' (used in the sense that you meant it) is, well then they must have different values in your part of the world. I know one of the people you responded to. He was offended by your remarks. Plus that person HAS been posting on the boards a lot longer than you, besides length of service does not give you a right to pontificate. Yesterday's first-time user has as much a right to his/her views as you and anybody else, and, most importantly, also has the right not to be attacked for same.

You may know six who do not post anymore, i personally know dozens who don't post as a result of the abuse they are likely to get. I also know of at least two who work in radio who were so distraught at posts about them that they broke down and cried. If you don't think this requires some form of control i have no further comment to make. There are many other reasons for the drop-off in posts at the new board, and most of them are desirous.

As always, your feedback has been appreciated.


The next i heard from JAMESDEANE was to complain about this thread:
http://www.radiowavesforum.com/rw/showthread.php?s=&threadid=826

I wrote back:


Thanks for writing.
Can you tell me your exact objection to the post?
I left it because it is laughable. Mr O'Callaghan is obviously not a woman and his listenership figures speak for themselves!
Nobody else has replied to it...that speaks for itself.
Post a response yourself?

Best wishes,
John

His reply asked me would i be insulted if somebody called me a woman. "I presume so," he continued.

Just because everyone does not object does not mean it shouldn't be removed.

This is typical of you lot again, You told me before that you removed a post before because it hurt someones feelings and brought them to tears, it does'nt mean the rest of us didnt find it funny!".

My reply is what he decided to release for public consumption. I've gone public with this to let people know the everyday hassles we face here. Cassie spent a lot of time removing JAMESDEANE's duplication of this post into every forum - and she had a lot of better things to do. The only point in that duplication was surely to cause us problems.

I'm now spending time replying to his post, defending myself, time put aside for working on the main site, which continues to suffer. Our immediate reaction was to ban JAMESDEANE (btw, that would have been a first, nobody else has been banned here, for all his suggestions about moderation). He has not been banned because, for us, it is a last resort, but particularly as i wish to give him right of reply.

Now you can all get back to reading posts about radio - i can go and update the newspage!

[John Fleming]

THE ONE SIDEDNESS OF THIS BOARD, IT IS MY FINAL POST, ALL THE PEOPLE THAT STARTED ON THIS BOARD WITH ME HAVE LEFT, I TRIED TO GIVE IT A GO BUT NOW REALISE THERE IS NO RIGHT TO FREEDOM OF EXPRESSION HERE

JAMESDEANE, if you have been around as long as that then you will know the opinion of us in relation to freedom of expression.

For the record, we reserve your right to freedom of speech, but only if you do. In other words, we are up front about who we are.
If you have points to make which are likely to lead to problems, use your real name and email address and don't hide behind a 'pseudonym'.
It is us that face any legal problems arising out of your statements, and unless you are also willing to face up to your legal responsibilities, you give us no option but to censor you. You will find very similar rules on every forum you come across on the web.
I also suspect that it was Ronan saying to himself 'enough is enough' that led to Radioanoraks going under. He gave me very strong warnings at what may happen here....
However, i will state now that there are enough decent-minded members posting on this board to warrant the forum worth fighting to hold onto. Otherwise i too would just give up. I used to dread going into the old boardhost board, by comparison this one is the pleasure it is meant to be.

One final point JAMESDEANE, in your profile you give your occupation as journalist. If you are one, surely you are aware of the kind of things one can and cannot say in public about other individuals?

And, i must be honest, your 'threat' to never post here again only fills me with relief.

[BillyBob]

John,

If I may speak for others for a moment - I think the vast majority of us who use this board are delighted at the professionalism, the regular updates and the attention to detail that is the hallmark of your site...

It is a pleasure to have a site to discuss and bitch and occasionally praise the radio we all love...

Please don't let one disgruntled individual affect you - the silent majority appreciate all you do for us!

Keep the Radiowaves flag flying - and never let the bastards grind you down!

Billybob

[Dane Bowers]

I have to agree with Billy Bob, and I also think that JAMESDEANE recieved far more of a response from you than he deserved.

I have to say I'm shocked at what you've to deal it, I think it should be a lesson to us all, to appreciate the hard work and effort you put into running this board.

Dane

PS: I feel stupid for my silly little emails now, sorry

[John Fleming]

Thanks for the support (and to those who emailed too).

This post was left up to give JAMESDEANE the opportunity to reply and defend his actions. Otherwise it serves no other purpose than to give an opportunity to remind members of the guidelines and will be removed tomorrow.

Please remember that throwaway comments posted about a fellow member or a public personality that probably takes you just a couple of minutes, can cause weeks worth of heartache to the targets.
Nobody should be beyond or above criticism, but if you feel the need to criticise, please make it constructive. Otherwise, the jealous and bitter tags can quite justifiably be used to discredit your remarks.

I have calmed down sufficiently - Cassie hasn't! - to realise that my reaction to JAMESDEANE didn't need to be so overzealous, but i do resent people who have absolutely no idea of what goes on behind the scenes reacting in the way he did to a post removal. I know it can frustrate and annoy any user to have their post removed, but there is always a good reason for it. In many instances it is actually for the poster's own protection (believe it or not). Anybody with any queries about this i will answer privately (seeking an assurance that it is not posted here next day!)

PS Dane, i have always said to you that it is a pleasure to help with any queries. Sometimes it feels that the 'silent majority' that BillyBob referred to don't exist and any mails we get just criticise and knock the (where's that violin when you need it!) difficult job that we have here. So it is always nice to hear from someone who just wants to take part. Do not hesitate to contact us with any future problems...

On a final note, we are looking for somebody with an understanding of legal issues that can offer some time to help with some problems...if any users are in this position, or know of anyone, please write to the usual address.
And at this point, it would be prudent to publicly thank Eoghan for the help he has already given us.

[Elaine]

Why do a very small majority of people want to cause trouble and ruin this site for everyone else? If it wasnt for John.. where would we wll go to talk about our love of radio? If u ask me john, you have the patience of a saint. Keep up the good work, we all really appriciate it. ps i also feel stupid for my emails now lol

[Francis Dunne]

Hello there long time no posts ... moved house u see but just wanted to say this

the domain name RADIOWAVES.FM did not come for free. It was paid for. last time I looked it was tripple digits for a domain name.

Therefore If John wishes to delete posts from a website which he is paying for then he is more than welcome to and has every right to

I say dont let this kind of crap get you down john. your doing a good job.

[Aquavid]

John,

As someone who runs a busy Message Board (different subject of interest entirely, so I won't plug it here!) I can really appreciate your position.

I run my board on Boardhost (though I'm considering changing that, due mainly to the crazy popups on Boardhost and the much better format available here). I've had problems in my time - one poster who would post violent and obscene messages (rape and murder fantasies) in the hope that it would get the board suspended for a TOS violation. (It turned out to be someone who was running another, less successful, board on the same topic). That's when I introduced password protection.

Even then, there is still the problem of members who take a dislike to each other, or who feel that they can write wholly libellous things about other people in the name of "free speech". For me, I hate deleting posts off my board, and it is always a last resort, but sometimes it has to be done.

There are two mistaken beliefs that people seem to have about Message Boards, firstly that they have a *right* tosay whatever they want, and secondly that if a posting was libellous, it would only be actionable against the poster.

My response to the first is that a Message Board on a website is like a letters page in a magazine, letters are accepted for publication but there is no guarentee that they will be published. Just because your post appears automatically does not change the need for editorial oversight - you are a guest of the pages of the owner of the website.

On the second point, there have been a number of cases which have established beyond doubt that the publisher of a libel is as guilty as the person who makes the statement. This is why a newspaper can be sued as well as a reporter. This is why a radio station could be sued for not correcting something that a caller said which was clearly libellous. There are also documented cases on the internet of the publisher, or in some cases even the service provider, being taken to court for the actions of individual users.

Here, John is the publisher, as I am on my site. We are expected to be held to the same standards as any other publisher, and quite rightly so.

And what of free speech?

Well, if Radiowaves were the only Message Board in the world, and it was not possible to set up another, then there would be concerns about removing posts.

But anyone can set up their own board, if they are really so concerned about what they want to say that they are willing to be the publisher themselves - and accountable for their actions.

Publish and be dammed - but don't hide behind others to do so.


Regards, Aquavid
(Gabriel C)

[The Mighty 890]

It has always puzzled me the way that narrow minded, mean spirited people often seem to be the most vocal in our society.

John, this board is a wonderful resource and long may you continue to provide the service. I for one fully appreciate the expense and the time that you put into operating it.

Don't let a tiny minority of begrudgers and cynics affect your enjoyment of the work that you do.

[Darren B]

James you are a sad sad little man

[sunshine101]

I think this site is brilliant.
Well done John and Cassie .......don't let them get you down.

[mrradio]

In defence of james deane he had suggested in the past on this and other boards that a small fee should be paid by members when they subscribe to any such service.

If it is such a big hassle to the organisers and people responsible for this site then shut it.

i stepped in yesterday as an observer of the site for over a year what happened was totally unfair.

all we have seen in the past few months is a constant moan from the organisers about how it is being run at the a massive cost to john and others.

[Ryan Phillips]

"If it is such a big hassle to the organisers and people responsible for this site then shut it"

Sorry but i think that totally misses the point. The reason that people keep pointing out the expense and time that goes into running this board is twofold. When other users do it it tends to be a show of appreciation for the time, effort and expense that goes into the board, they're entitled to do that. When any of the admin folks bring it up its always in response to someone having a go at them for the way they run the site.

Its not like John comes on the board and starts a thread every week saying, "Just to remind you all, this board costs me a lot of money and its a pain in the hole, dont ever forget that" Its only when someone criticises the board that he would be prompted to respond. In simple terms its like someone going "I dont like the way you do this this this and this, its wrong, you shouldnt be doing it like that, what gives you the right to do what you just did" to which he says, "what gives me the right to do what i've just done is that i pay for it. When you pay for a site and board you can run it and moderate it as you wish. This is how i've chosen to moderate mine, thats my decision"

Let me put it another way.... did your parents never say to you "while you live in my house, you live by my rules"? If not maybe they should have but thats the same thing

Either way i think what is said is a measured response to whatever criticism is levelled at the board and a far cry from "all we have seen in the past few months is a constant moan from the organisers about how it is being run at the a massive cost to john and others"

There's no such thing as absolute free speech it doesnt exist so running around screaming "what about free speech, i have a right to say whatever i want" will get you nowhere. If everyone has a right to free speech why do people hide behind pseudonys? Surely you can post anything you like under your real name, who can give out to you, fire you, sue you, its your right to say what you like right? Wrong. I've no problem with people saying anything at all under their real name at least that way you can be fired or sued for your comments but free speech with immunity is a dangerous weapon safer kept out of certain peoples hands

At the end of the day all admin did was remove a few posts that they thought crossed the line, naturally the people who posted it didnt think it crossed the line, the difference is as moderators of the board John and Cassie and co are the people who decide where the line is on this particular site. I think the fact that they would always tell you at your request why your post was removed speaks volumns.

Annnnnythewho, i just thought that last post missed the mark so i thought i'd throw in my 2 Cents(and now that we're in euros thats not just an american saying)

Oh finally i dont think that the subscription thing is a goer, as i've said in the post i dont think its paying the money they mind, its more the abuse from ungrateful people surely?

Cheers,

Ryan

Ps. IF i was a cynical person i'd have to take a close look at the day James promised never to post again and the day MrRadio felt obliged to start posting.....happily im not a cynical person

[Turiel]

First, let me say thanks to John & Cassie for their hard work in keeping this site updated, and they don't get recognition often enough. Now that that is over, I beg to disagree with you on a certain point Mr. Phillips :)

Originally posted by ryan phillips
say what you like right? Wrong. I've no problem with people saying anything at all under their real name at least that way you can be fired or sued for your comments but free speech with immunity is a dangerous weapon safer kept out of certain peoples hands


Ack! No no no no. Free speech with anonynimty (sp?) is a GOOD thing. I know you said immunity but I think you mean the same thing. Think about it - Employee in Big Coroporation notices that his company is doing something illegal or something which it would not like the public to know. He posts on the internet about it in an attempt to get it stopped. Of course, had he posted under his own name, he would have been fired/killed/whatever. Anonyimity, especially on the Internet, is very very important. If we all have to post under our own name, or some other form of trackable id, privacy goes out the window.

BTW - before you talk about conspiracy theories and such in relation to my example - it HAS happened. Lots. Microsoft is probably the biggest real life example of this. Halloween documents, other disclosed memoes, etc etc... all very important items in the AntiTrust trial, and which would NOT have been disclosed to the public if there wasnt anonymous free speech available on the net.

Now, having said all that, the administrators have a right to moderate the site, which they do. People can post whatever they want (according to the guidelines of the EULA we all accepted when we registered), but if it gets removed, tough sh*t.

[RadioFriend]

I must say that this board is fantastic and im often excited about going on line to read new posts(Yes i do have a sad life)

Its a great place to make new friends and old and also a very fair platform for which to vent.......

I want to thank you both John and Cassie for their (unpaid) time and help.....

Regards

RF

[vinylpusher]

Originally posted by Turiel
Anonyimity, especially on the Internet, is very very important. If we all have to post under our own name, or some other form of trackable id, privacy goes out the window.


Anonymity on the internet is a very misunderstood concept.
One might believe that they are being anonymous just by using a pseudonym, but they tend to forget that they can be traced back via an IP or DNS system. Every internet based activity is traceable.... forum posts, emails, even downloads, and all internet accounts have their movements logged by their service providors.

Your best bet up until recently would have been to use an internet cafe, but they've started to require that you sign up for an account with them and soon that will be a standard practice.

If real anonymity existed on the web, the creators of the biggest virus threats (Nimda, Cod Red, etc) would still be at large, and many of todays known paedophiles would never have been caught. That's just the tip of the iceberg.

Anyway, back to the original topic........I'd just like to congratulate John, Cassie & team on a fantastic job so far with this site and long may it continue, regardless of what minority wants to try and see to it's demise.

Oh, and I agree with Ryan about MrRadio rising like a phoenix from the JAMESDEANE ashes to suddenly start posting in support of his comments. But then again that's my cynical opinion.

[Ryan Phillips]

While this is moving slightly away from the radio end of discussion given that its central to this thread and John has said he intends to close this thread soon im gonna reply to Turiel here

Anonymity in the way you're talking about it is NOT a good thing and i dont need to go into conspiracy theories etc to refute your examples.The only problem im facing here in making my argument is where to start. You cite the Microsoft case and use this theoretical example.

"Employee in Big Coroporation notices that his company is doing something illegal or something which it would not like the public to know. He posts on the internet about it in an attempt to get it stopped"

Ok call me old fashioned but wouldnt a better way to stop someone doing something illegal be to report it to the proper authorities(police,the friendly taxman,spiderman perhaps and so on....) If someone is doing something illegal why the hell would the best way to stop it be to post it on an internet board, it has so little credibility on a board such as this from an anonymous tipster surely?? And there is nothing to stop them doing so. They cant be fired for it and if they are they can sue. There's no problems with breach of confidence or contract of employment because of public interest exceptions in this type of situation.

""!BTW - before you talk about conspiracy theories and such in relation to my example - it HAS happened. Lots. Microsoft is probably the biggest real life example of this. Halloween documents, other disclosed memoes, etc etc... all very important items in the AntiTrust trial, and which would NOT have been disclosed to the public if there wasnt anonymous free speech available on the net"

This kind of just follows on from what i said before. Everything that was disclosed could have been disclosed to the proper authorities and they could have dealt with it. We would all have then been able to find out that way. Further, if you're concerned about getting the word to the public, tip of a major paper. They will then take steps to verify the info and spread the word. If they are wrong they will be sued, and rightly so. You cant just falsly accuse people of doing stuff, which is precisely what anonymous posting allows you to do. Falsely accuse people with immunity. How can you say that that is a good thing? Everything you say that anonymous posting allows for can equally be provided for by alerting the police(or appropriate authority) and a large newspaper for example. I dont think you'd be standing by your theory if i was using a fake name here to suggest say for example you were using sexual favours with men to get ahead in the radio world? Would you still say i should be allowed to do that because it'd destroy my privacy otherwise


"Anonyimity, especially on the Internet, is very very important. If we all have to post under our own name, or some other form of trackable id, privacy goes out the window"

Sorry to be awkward but i totally disagree again. Firstly im not saying you have to post under your real name, im saying you have to be held accountable for everything you say. Its not a privacy issue. Privacy means people cant find out stuff that they should be able to find out about you.(An oversimplistic definition but it'll do for now) Under your theory i can come on, knowing who you are and say "Did you hear about X, he's been spotted taking little kids from their parents in the park and having his way with them" and i can do that under a fake name?? Thats not privacy at all. I cant and shouldnt be able to do that. I know where you're coming from though, youre talking about anyone being able to read your e-mails etc. Thats completely different, thats a private communication between the parties, that is private. How can something you post on a "public" forum be "private

Just one or 2 final thought type things. I think that (a)Your "pros" if you like are strongly outweighed by the cons (b) Anonymous posting can have serious negative effects. Given that you use a corporate example i'll do so to. Stock markets for example are increasingly under threat by anonymous board postings(particularly Yahoo boards it seems) People are wreaking havoc with share prices by anonymously posting false information about the companys, often losing them billions of dollars. There's a rake load of cases in the states at present all against "John Doe" trying to get yahoo to reveal who the posters are. Its also being used to perpetrate fraud, again in stocks etc with traders purposely undermining shares in companies, then when the prices fall because of their rumour-mongering the traders buy, start posting encouraging messages and the prices rise and hey presto you've illegally made a fortune.....i challenge you to tell me how all of the above deserves protection!!(Though maybe we should continue this in another section of the board)

[Turiel]

God damn essays ;)

Right at the moment, I can't really put in to words the meanings I want to express. Its kinda complicated, and if I'm going to get into this argument, I wan't to give you an informed answer I can back up with facts. So give me a few days and I'll come up with a response.

[John Fleming]

QUOTING mrradio
In defence of james deane he had suggested in the past on this and other boards that a small fee should be paid by members when they subscribe to any such service. all we have seen in the past few months is a constant moan from the organisers about how it is being run at the a massive cost to john and others.

Charging for the service would be impossible to do. Gathering a subscription would limit the service to a small number of users.
How would you charge? By amount of posts? The cost in administering that would make the charge prohibitive. And first-time users and casual observers would not be able to take part. Besides, this IS a free service to users and we are glad to provide it. It does gall me when people moan about it because i have put a lot of money - and much, much more importantly to me - time - into it.
I would certainly never moan or tell people who provide me with a free service what to do. That said, we do ask for and welcome feedback, positive or negative, but although the reasons for post removals are open to debate (and this is exactly why i have always requested that it be kept private - it is only when people attack my decisions publicly that i have 'moaned' about cost etc) our decisions have got to be accepted as final, and hopefully we can all move on together.
I do think it is very easy for many users here to forget that there are human beings working behind the scenes here, and that this can take up a lot of time. So when i do bring it up, it is not a moan, just a gentle reminder whenever anybody abuses us. And, anyway (hint, hint!) it is always nice to receive some positive feedback.

QUOTING from mrradio again

If it is such a big hassle to the organisers and people responsible for this site then shut it.

Erm, in a word, no! It is a hassle because a small minority make it that way. I have always attempted to appeal to their better senses and pointed out that bitchiness and libel helps no-one, and that they are risking the availability of this service for everyone, not just themselves. The feedback on this thread alone tells me this is a service worth keeping for the majority who want to use it as it is intended for use.

QUOTING from 'mrradio'
i stepped in yesterday as an observer of the site for over a year what happened was totally unfair.

mrradio, I am not going to embarrass you by posting yours and JAMESDEANE'S IP details here, but please let me advise 'both of you' to bear in mind that where it says your IP details have been logged at the bottom of your post, it means exactly that!

On the issue of free speech and anonymity, both Ryan and Turiel have made excellent points. They are also developing a fascinating thread on the subject, so i won't comment any further than this: I have stated here many times that i do believe in free speech - but on an internet forum it is a little more complicated than just posting whatever you fancy.
Turiel, your point about an employee needing to retain anonymity is great but what must be remembered is that the person hosting the message board where any message is posted is held as responsible for that post as the poster himself. I would love to offer an outlet here where we can all be revolutionaries together, but as i keep pointing out, i will not stand alone on this. That is why i insist on proper names - or at the very least - proper emails, which can be hidden of course, for 'dodgy' material.

Your final point in your first post hits the nail on the head...at this board we reserve the right etc and anyone who posts here has agreed to that...so i don't understand it when there are complaints.

[VO Guy]

Originally posted by BillyBob
John,

Keep the Radiowaves flag flying - and never let the bastards grind you down!

Billybob

I agree with Billybob....keep it up !!

[Jimbob]

With regards to the board i think the guys spend a lot of their own spare time and effort in moderating and if you object to a removal fire away but hey its only a board.

Vinylpusher said
"Anonymity on the internet is a very misunderstood concept.
One might believe that they are being anonymous just by using a pseudonym, but they tend to forget that they can be traced back via an IP or DNS system. Every Internet based activity is traceable.... forum posts, emails, even downloads, and all Internet accounts have their movements logged by their service providers."

A lot of what you say is true but not quite to the extent that you speak of. ISP providers only keep the subject line of e-mails (not the body) for a period of 6 months. As for web tracking that is not a common practice yet as it would take up far too much hard drive space. Although there is a new EU directive calling for the storage of all E-Mails (body included) , web activity, phone texts etc ,for a period of 6 years but the office of the Data protection Act are opposed to the legislation at present.


Just like on this board the webmaster by law can only hold information on posters for 6 months unless its billing information.

But hey if you don’t post nasty postings why even worry. Keep up the good work lads :))

:confused:

[Euan Roberts]

John Fleming,

Does that mean that I Euan Roberts in next in line for a serious showdown with Radio Anoraks if i dare say one bad thing about someone. I'm kinda worried now. I feel like i'm been targeted by the mafia. Hey what is acceptable and what is not? I don't understand some of what your saying, maybe i'm stupid in comprehending and interpreting your posts properly
on the lighter side, I gotta admire your fine writing, something i pretty weak on.

Euan Roberts

[John Fleming]

:confused:

Euan Roberts,

You have written to me by email countless times wondering about this, and have also posted elsewhere in this forum posing a similar question. Every time the answer has been the same so i'm not going to go to the bother of retyping it here :)

BTW, this is 'Radiowaves', you consistently refer to this site as "RadioAnoraks" - which does Ronan and the contributors there a disservice for the fine site it was in its heyday!
RadioAnoraks ceased to exist at the end of last year, killed - for the best part - by the likes of our 'friend' JAMESDEANE, who have somehow managed to convince themselves that they have the right to go onto message boards run by other people for the purpose of discussing radio and say whatever they like, and damn the consequences - and the wishes of everybody else.

Euan, any similar enquiries along these lines would be better dealt with in private, as has always been requested of all the contributors to this site. I have always preferred the board to be kept clutter-free (hairs rising on back of neck!) for the discussion of radio only - most people are paying by the minute for internet access (note to foreign contributors - yes that is the case in 'modern', progressive Ireland!) and it is unfair to expect them to cough up to read 'personal' concerns which can be dealt with in private.

[Billy Dane]

I'm speaking as one who long ago gave up on these boards because of all the bitching. But this board seems to be slowly getting rid of the small amount of fools that wanted to ruin the enjoyment for everyone else, and for that the people behind it must be congratulated. I fully support the position held against James Dean.

Euan, if you can back it up, the truth will not cause you problems. Some of your posts have been filled with ranting that seems to go far beyond what is necessary. Then you tend to rant at anyone who points this out to you, then you come back and apologise wholeheartedly to them! I think you just need to read what's been said on this thread and in the register form to find out what's acceptable. Seems straightforward enough to me.

[Euan Roberts]

Billy, if life was as easy as that, wouldn't it be sweet. However, i take your very valid and logical points that you have made. Nevertheless, one feels compelled on occasion to act somewhat bitter towards station owners on the state of radio in Dublin at present.

I guess its an underlying frustration that they are not listening to forums like this, and as a result, stations owners are not taking our posts seriously to change or make some improvements to their radio stations. Don't get me wrong, not everyone that is an anorak member has worked in radio. In addition, they also don't have the on-air experience or the technical or programming skills to be taken very seriously by station owners.

On occasion i have done that and have paid the price through a back lash from some radio anoraks. Sure, i dug my grave doing that. I'm not deliberately looking for publicity by ranting around making untrue statements about stations, i guess i'm just a little strong sometimes. Buy hey, one can work on that, as i do appreciate that we do need a degree of order amongst anoraks and i will include myself in that. But you are right, i should think before i post something.

I guess now most of my posts are become more light-hearted and less contentious in nature as i see what i've done in the past as been pretty fruitless to say the least. Thanks for the advice Billy.

Euan Roberts

[Radio Presenter]

>>>I guess its an underlying frustration that they are not listening to forums like this, and as a result, stations owners are not taking our posts seriously to change or make some improvements to their radio stations.<<<

There's a great saying: "Everyone's a Programmer!"

Programme Controllers don't give a 'flying fiddlers' about suggestions made on boards like this. After all, our thoughts are tarnished with a more than average opinion on radio...as opposed to the real Joe Soap. That's why they listen to what the audience says. Listeners programme their own stations. Fact!

Like or loath it, the more professional stations in this country conduct callout research and auditorium music testing. They guage what REAL listeners want to hear from their favourite station and implement changes (music/features etc.) were necessary.

:)

[Anorak]

james deane talks about the right to attack others on this board? Well jamesdeane, I would rather have somebody with something interesting to say about radio than the bile and venom you have proved you are capable of. I have started making posts because of the concerted efforts of admin to rid the board of your type, I see another member in this thread has said exactly the same.
Good riddants to you!

[ex-pirate]

I'm sure 99% of us would back up John Flemings comments about this person, and also ponder one day that John will and say that's enough and close this site down, leaving those who have genuine thoughts about radio with nothing to report to or hear about.
You could go to the english chatrooms, but then that would be desparate.

Keep up the good work John, we appreciate the effort, time and the funding that you put into keeping this site going and more time could be used looking into other things without worrying and having sleepless nights about legal matters.

[Euan Roberts]

STOP, STOP, STOP, STOP, STOP, STOP STOP, STOP,STOP. THE WHOLE GOD DAMN LOT OF YOU. STOP BITCHING, ABOUT ME, ABOUT MY POSTS. ANORAK HOW DARE YOU ATTEMPT TO COMPARE ME TO JAMES DEANE. STOP IT PLEASE. NO MORE OF THIS. POSTED SUNDAY AFTERNOON @ 16.30PM JULY 14, 2002

[Jimbob]

Ok Euan or whatever you call yourself today ,you have now proven your dedication to intelligent posting to all who read the board. You have lost it man!

[Anorak]

ANORAK HOW DARE YOU ATTEMPT TO COMPARE ME TO JAMES DEANE. STOP IT PLEASE. NO MORE OF THIS. POSTED SUNDAY AFTERNOON @ 16.30PM JULY 14, 2002

Euan, Brakeout, Steely Dan, [Whatever Todays Username Is],

Not every post is about you. This whole board doesn't revolve around you and your various personas. Read my post one more time. Slowly. And then enlighten us all where it even mentions you, let alone compares you to jamesdeane?

As you brought my name up in relation to your own, can I say that this board would be the duller without you, in the same way that the BB3 house would be duller without Jade, for all her faults.

[Euan Roberts]

okay, i never said the board and its personas revolved around me. For starters, i have one persona now and that is Euan Roberts. There will no other personas in the future. Fair enough Anorak, i take your points, one misjudged the situation like i do alot of the time. In reference to your comment about the board been duller without me, i think the board would be very dull without all of us and our contributions to this website.

Euan Roberts

[Billy Dane]

Another thread turned on its head and made about you, Euan.

Anyway, I want to thank James Dean. From what I can see there has been an increase in posts since this blew up, but more importantly, there is a lot less bitchiness. He allowed admin and everyone else to register their disgust in public and highlight the legal implications of libelous posts.

He didn't take your invitation to respond John. I've no doubt he still drops by though!

[Euan Roberts]

Billy, you really are determined to make life hell for me on this forum. I hope your enjoying it whatever gives you most pleasure.

Euan

[John Fleming]

He didn't take your invitation to respond John. I've no doubt he still drops by though!

He does still drop by - although not usually under his username - and tried to reply to this thread today. Unfortunately, i had already - in the last couple of days - disabled his ability to post under his username as the assumption was, at this stage, that he had no intention of replying.

This came to a head because he still sends me emails knocking me and the site, despite me telling him long ago i would only respond in public as a result of him breaching the privacy of the email that started this thread.

Just to let you know where it stands.

[P.F.L]

I have to agree with all persons who wrote expressing there love of this brillant site

Big thanks to John and Cassie for giving people with a passion for radio a medium to further discuss their loves

P.F.L

[Anorak]

Just noticed this from John Fleming at the start of this mammoth thread:

The next i heard from JAMESDEANE was to complain about this thread: http://www.radiowavesforum.com/rw/s...s=&threadid=826


Let me get this straight. He has a major problem with censorship against himself, yet he wrote complaining about a post and asked for it to be removed? James deane you are not only very sad, but a bloody hypocrite!

[JamesDeane]

Anorak dont speak if you dont know what you are talking about.

The ALL READ post has attracted a very large number of postings and an incredible amount of viewings.

I am happy the matter has been brought out into the open.

I think admin have handled the matter badly but I wont moan because to be honest I dont really care.

i have alot more to worry about in my life than this board.

Although I think I have made worthy contributions in the past.

I am shocked by the people who are criticising me who have never spoken to me or replied to my posts in the past, they are siding with admin, in an attempt to get something out of it.

I will continue to visit the site to observe the goings on.

Its a valuable resource for the industry and one which I have praised in the past countless times.

I will make a suggestion again, a minimal once off initial subscription would go along way tp helping the crew who run this site.

I would be willing to pay it even though I wont be posting.

Cu Round,

Jamesdeane.

[Anorak]

Anorak dont speak if you dont know what you are talking about.

You complained about a post and asked for its removal - that makes you a hypocrite. Nothing more needs to be said on the matter.

I think admin have handled the matter badly
Admin didn't have to give you a reason, didn't have to enter into dialogue with you, and didn't expect to see their private correspondence posted for the world to read. If anyone acted badly it was you.

I am shocked by the people who are criticising me who have never spoken to me or replied to my posts in the past, they are siding with admin, in an attempt to get something out of it.

What...in the same way that you attacked somebody in a post that started this whole sorry affair?!
I, and I'm sure others, would love to know exactly what there is to gain by siding with admin on this matter - apart from a more enjoyable board without fear of being abused in a post by the likes of you...this has been a constant theme of yours. Those who don't agree with you have some sort of problem. In this case, the vast majority of users were vocal in their disagreement of you, but they were only doing it to side with admin? Convince yourself of that all you like if it keeps you happy but I think that's just sad.

Can't fault you on the remainder of your post mind...fair play to you for your humility, at least.